Ever caught yourself thinking, “Why should I be the one to fix this?” or “That sounds like a YOU problem”?
That flash of defensiveness might feel natural, but it could be blocking a chance to grow, connect, and lead more effectively.
In this episode of Beyond the Class, Katie Trotter, Chief Program Officer at the Chapman Foundation for Caring Communities, explores the ownership mindset. This approach invites leaders to ask, “What part can I own?” even when the situation feels mostly out of their control.
Katie introduces the idea of ‘the gap.’ The space between what happens and how we choose to respond. It’s in this space that leaders can shift from blame to responsibility, from frustration to curiosity, and from reaction to reflection.
Through real-life stories and practical tools, Katie unpacks how small shifts in ownership can build trust, strengthen teams, and create psychological safety. You’ll learn how to:
- Recognize the difference between blame and responsibility
- Use reflection to respond with intention
- Ask questions that move conversations forward
- Build trust through consistent, small acts of ownership
- Create space for growth even when things go wrong
If you’re ready to shift from defensiveness to development in your leadership journey, this episode offers the practical guidance and actionable steps to get started today.
If you’re interested in exploring these concepts further, check out Our Community Serves, a two-day class on mindsets that help shift from a me-centric to a we-centric culture. CLICK HERE TO LEARN MORE.
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KATIE TROTTER: 0:00
Of course, these are great questions to ask yourself when you’re in a tough situation and want to grow from it. For example, what was I pretending not to know in this situation?
ADAM SALGAT: 0:10
Hello and welcome to Beyond the Class From Knowledge to Action, the audio cast that helps Chapman Foundation alumni continue the journey of applying the skills they’ve built and turning them into practical, intentional actions for everyday life. I’m your host, adam Solgut, and today we’re diving into a mindset shift that can change how you lead, how you relate and how you grow, even when things go wrong and it’s not your fault. If you’ve ever found yourself thinking why should I be the one to fix this? Or this isn’t my responsibility, or a personal favorite that I’ve heard people use, that sounds like a you problem. This episode is going to explain that staying in that mindset eliminates opportunities for growth, and then we’ll give you ways to help you get past that and into what today’s episode is all about. And into what today’s episode is all about the ownership mindset, what it is, what it’s not, and how it can help you grow in any situation. Joining me today again which I’m very happy to have her back is Katie Trotter, chief Program Officer at the Chapman Foundation for Caring Communities. Katie, welcome back.
KATIE TROTTER: 1:21
Thanks, adam. I’m really glad to be here today. This topic is one that I’ve seen make a real difference, not just in personal growth, but in how teams function and trust each other, so I’m looking forward to talking about it more.
ADAM SALGAT: 1:33
All right. Well, let’s get started with some basics. Katie, you wrote a blog on this topic and in there you made a really important distinction. Ownership isn’t about blame. Can you unpack that a little bit for us?
KATIE TROTTER: 1:53
Absolutely. A lot of people hear ownership and think it means taking the fall or admitting fault, but that’s not what we’re talking about here. Ownership is about asking what’s my role in this or in those other moments. Just how do I want to respond? It’s about choosing growth over defensiveness. Even when something isn’t your fault, you still have power in how you show up.
ADAM SALGAT: 2:11
That is a powerful shift, and I say that because of a few reasons. The idea of taking ownership and that it means taking the blame hits kind of hard With me. Anyway, there was a point in my career where I took everything as my fault, thinking exactly what you said that ownership meant taking the fall.
KATIE TROTTER: 2:30
Yeah, and when you get stuck in that space, adam, I’m curious, like, what kind of impact did that have on you?
ADAM SALGAT: 2:35
Yeah, for me it wrecked my confidence. It made me question even the simplest of choices, things that I would never question because I’ve had years of experience and have the gut to do it. But in the end, questioning that confidence led to apathy and low production. But I got through that by using some of the tools that we teach. So I’d love for us to get started and start looking at those. In my opening, I made a few statements there, statements that can keep people stuck. Statements around the idea of why should I be the one to fix this? This isn’t my responsibility or, like I said, one of my favorites. That sounds like a you problem To me. Those are classic phrases, like I said, that illustrate deflecting responsibility, but doing that keeps us stuck. Can you give an example of what that can look like?
KATIE TROTTER: 3:22
Yeah, let’s just say you have a project that you’re working on and it completely goes sideways.
KATIE TROTTER: 3:27
And the very first thought that you have might be well, I wasn’t the one who dropped the ball, and that might be true. But if we stop there, we’re missing the chance to ask hey, what could I have done differently, or how might I be able to help this go better the next time. And we can do this sometimes because deflection feels safe. But at the same time, it really can limit growth and I sometimes like to think of taking ownership like working out. Logically, it makes sense that it would be good for us to do, but actually doing it takes a lot of hard work and can sometimes be a little bit uncomfortable, and it requires discipline. Now, there’s no doubt in my mind that it’s often much easier when things go wrong to notice what other people did wrong, who let us down, who underperformed. But when we let ourselves stay I think the word you used, adam, was stuck when we let ourselves stay stuck in that space, we’re really denying ourselves a growth opportunity.
ADAM SALGAT: 4:23
That analogy of thinking about this as working out I really love, because many times it’s hard to go work out, in that it’s hard to get it started, but by the time you’re done working out, I don’t know about the rest of you, but I’ve almost never finished the workout and said, man, I hated that, I just did that. Yes.
KATIE TROTTER: 4:40
Right Point.
ADAM SALGAT: 4:41
Almost this euphoria, knowing that I did something to improve my body, improve my health. And so, if we think about it in the same context, you’re doing something to improve your career, improve your mindset Right.
KATIE TROTTER: 4:53
Yeah, and I sometimes like to use the term. It’s a level up opportunity Right In these moments. How can I be looking for a way that I can continue to develop and grow and reach that next level can?
ADAM SALGAT: 5:03
continue to develop and grow and reach that next level. Keep going down that path. You’ve presented the idea before that even if it is someone else’s fault that they’re 98% responsible, there’s still 2% we can own. Why do you find that so powerful?
KATIE TROTTER: 5:16
I think this is such an important concept because it’s within that 2% where the real learning starts to happen. It’s there where we can shift from being passive recipients of circumstances to active participants in our own development.
ADAM SALGAT: 5:32
Katie, do you have an example you could give us, potentially like a real life example, to help us understand better about that? 2%.
KATIE TROTTER: 5:40
Yeah, I have a young woman that I was mentoring we will, for the purpose of this audio cast, call her Jane and Jane had been working on a group project. She was staying up late, getting all of her work done, double checking and looking for ways that she could improve her end of the presentation, making sure that everything was really at a high level. At a high level, and as she was going along, she had a partner that was working in the group who was consistently missing deadlines and by the time the end product came out, it was definitely at a lower level of performance than what was anticipated for the group. So that had an overall impact on everybody’s final product. And what I really appreciated or admired about Jane was that when we had our meeting or kind of talking through that process, she could have chosen to focus on the 98, right. She had met the deadlines. She held her work product up to a really high standard.
KATIE TROTTER: 6:33
There was obviously a person in the group who had a very negative impact on the end. We’re not debating that. But Jane didn’t want to say stuck on ruminating in that space, right? Instead, what she did was look for hey, what’s my 2%? How do I not waste this opportunity and let it go by without learning anything. So instead Jane started asking herself questions around. Hey, I wonder how I might have been able to set expectations more clearly. Or I wonder what it would look like to better be a supportive participant when I’m partnering with other people on a team. I was just blown away by seeing how she shifted from frustration over this area she couldn’t control to feeling really empowered. Thinking about that 2%.
ADAM SALGAT: 7:15
That is wonderful, yeah, because I think it’d be very easy right to sit in that space and kind of say I’m just upset and mad at this person and they brought us down, but instead she’s taking the opportunity to say maybe I could have supported them differently, and I think that’s a great opportunity to really, you know, talk about exactly what we’re talking about here. She took that 2% and is looking at it. So, now that we’ve decided to look for that 2%, you mentioned in your blog that you describe a moment that follows as the gap. So, using that example you just shared, the gap is that time between when something happens and our response to it. Tell me a little bit more about why that space is important and how Jane had opportunity to use the gap here.
KATIE TROTTER: 8:00
Yes, this is where all the good stuff lives, adam. There’s this gap where we get a chance to do a few things like reflect on everything that’s happened and, in that moment, build intention. What is it that’s most important to me right now? What do I want to take from this? And do that with a lot of focus so that you’re able to grow and learn and develop.
KATIE TROTTER: 8:21
But when we ignore that gap, we sometimes just react automatically, we give away our power in that space, right, we’re just a victim of our circumstance. And when we really can shift from that to pausing and choosing our response, that’s when we really step into ownership. And, as we’ve already talked about, it’s not always easy, but it’s really where real leadership begins. Adam, I do want to say there’s this element that we touched on briefly, but taking this mindset of ownership doesn’t mean that we’re taking responsibility away from somebody else who did the 98, right. So you might have somebody who really does have a challenge. They didn’t meet their performance goals, they didn’t deliver on a promise that they had made, whatever that might look like. I just like to separate those two out because it’s not like Jane was saying I’m 100% responsible for what happened, right? So she’s really just focusing on the area she can control.
ADAM SALGAT: 9:12
And so the idea of her being able to control how she maybe supports someone is something she can look at as a potential growth opportunity for herself in the future.
KATIE TROTTER: 9:21
Yes, absolutely.ADAM SALGAT: 9:23
In the blog that you wrote on this subject. One of my favorite parts is how you connected ownership to trust. Tell me more about that.
KATIE TROTTER: 9:31
Yeah, when leaders model ownership, it creates psychological safety, right. It’s showing your team that it’s okay to be human, to make mistakes and to learn from them, and that’s when you really start to build a culture where people can feel safe to speak up and take risks right, they know that they’re not going to be blamed, they’ll be supported, and it kind of makes sense if you think about the fact that you have a group of humans all trying to work towards a common mission or achieve a common project. We know humans make mistakes, so the idea of taking ownership is just how do we model that in a way that allows people to feel like we can just acknowledge it and move forward?
ADAM SALGAT: 10:07
And I think modeling that gives the opportunity for someone who truly is looking at this reflectively and seeing how you’re taking responsibility as a leader, to then say to themselves, wow, I did not do maybe what I said I was going to do or what I did, and give them opportunity to grow, to say, okay, I need to take ownership of what I said I was going to do. There is that growth opportunity and that’s what we’re talking about here, katie. I am curious, though, about trust, and I want you to touch on you know, for you as a leader personally, why do you find that important? What does cultivating trust amongst the team that you lead do for you?
KATIE TROTTER: 10:49
Adam, I don’t want to overstate this, but I feel like trust just makes everything work better. It cuts down on friction, it makes the times that we collaborate more enjoyable and it really helps us stay focused on what actually matters instead of getting caught up in defensiveness or doubt. If we’re working on a team together and we have to constantly be questioning somebody’s motives or a hidden agenda or whether they’re actually going to do what they said they were going to do, that takes up so much of our energy. That would be better served being really targeted on the goals that we’re trying to achieve.
ADAM SALGAT: 11:22
Trust is something that our organization really focuses on in our leadership class, Our Community Transforms. Can you talk a little bit about that?
KATIE TROTTER: 11:31
Yeah, in transforms, we really talk about not just, hey, trust is really important, but breaking it down to what are the behaviors and elements that go into building and maintaining a trusting work environment. Because it’s easy enough to just say, hey, this is important, but we really want to walk through what are some tangible tools that we can take back to our teams.
ADAM SALGAT: 11:51
So, speaking of some tangible tools, this is exactly where I want to get to now, as we start to talk about shifting into an ownership mindset. I mean, we’ve brought up some examples and we’ve talked about how to do this a bit, but let’s give some more concrete examples. So in your blog, you offer some questions. Can you go through these and touch on them a little bit?
KATIE TROTTER: 12:13
Yeah, let’s just start with three, adam. The first one here is just what part of this can I own? That’s kind of scanning for that 2%. I’ll be honest, sometimes mine’s closer to the 70, 80, 90%. Right, but whatever the situation, just looking at what are the parts in this that were my responsibility that I might have dropped the ball on Gotcha.
KATIE TROTTER: 12:36
The second one is what’s my role in this dynamic? And sometimes it can be a little bit nuanced because technically, something might not have your name next to it with a sense of ownership, but you might still play a role. Were you in charge of providing resources and information, were you in a project management role, and maybe you didn’t provide some of the guidance or reminders you typically would have. So I think that’s a helpful way to kind of look at it a little bit differently. And then the third one, which is one of my favorites, is just what do I want to have be true about how I handle this? And what I love about this one is this gets back to regardless of what situation I’m in, regardless of what percentage of the role I played in it, what I’m asking is who do I want to be in this moment? Because that’s how I want to show up in my response.
ADAM SALGAT: 13:16
I like number two there about the what is my role in this dynamic, because it reminds me a lot of the opportunity as a leader to say, okay, my name is not necessarily on this project, but I am the leader of the organization, or I am the leader of this department and my opportunity to support this and make sure it’s coming along the way that it needs to for the organization on the whole is a good reminder to say, okay, my name might not be on it and I might not be like 98% responsible for it, but I am responsible in some ways.
KATIE TROTTER: 13:50
Yes, Adam, that’s a great example of how these types of questions can really help shift us from frustration to action. They’re quite simple in their form, but incredibly powerful.
ADAM SALGAT: 14:01
This reminds me of a recent experience I had and I was wondering do you mind if I share a bit of a personal example, a personal story here?
KATIE TROTTER: 14:09
Yeah, go for it.
ADAM SALGAT: 14:11
So a little while back I sent an email to some teammates I don’t typically work with very often. My intention was to present an idea for something we could work on in the future, and the initial email was kind of long and detailed. The initial responses that I got back asked me a couple questions and caused me to reflect. I realized I may have overwhelmed them or introduced plans that didn’t align with our current strategy. Even though I tried to soften the message with my word choices, I could sense some apprehension. So I sat back and I asked myself how could I have done this better? That’s when I started thinking about my teammates’ behavioral tendencies, along with the work that they might already have on their plates.
ADAM SALGAT: 14:57
Even though it wasn’t my intention to overwhelm them, the amount of detail I included could easily have been taken that way. The bullet point lists I included might have appeared as to-do lists instead of their intention as just a list of ideas, bullet it out. I took the opportunity to reflect on what part of this situation I could own and I’ll be honest, a younger version of me might have said hey, this isn’t my fault how they perceived it. I covered my bases, I used the words I felt painted the right picture in my head. I covered my bases, I used the words that I felt painted the right picture in my head, but, as you’ve said, that mindset doesn’t help us grow, doesn’t help us move forward. So by stepping back and asking some of those ownership questions, I realized I could better connect with the team and present ideas more thoughtfully in the future.
KATIE TROTTER: 15:46
Adam, that’s such a great example. It really shows how ownership isn’t about beating yourself up or just getting mad at other people right, it’s really about being curious and intentional. And when I think about some of those shifts that you made, right, considering it through their preferred way of communicating with their behavioral tendency, or how it might have been interpreted differently. What I love about that is that you weren’t fixated on did I technically do something wrong? Right, instead, you were looking for hey, if we’re in the situation anyway, where’s my two percent level up opportunity? Right? Don’t want to waste this moment or let it go by without seeing. Is there a way that I can improve from this? And it’s in those small shifts that teams and co-workers really build a lot of trust and connection over time.
ADAM SALGAT: 16:31
And I will say I appreciate everything you said there and I want to say it’s not easy to get to the point of reflecting back and looking how do I maybe do this differently? And then even also taking the opportunity to talk with those teammates about that, email person to person to kind of say, hey, let’s now talk through this. Because I feel like your response brought up some apprehension or brought up maybe an anxiety, and I want to make sure that that wasn’t where I was going with it and I want to make sure you understand how we can move forward and let’s work on that together. And it was great conversations to have. But it does make me realize next time, what can I do differently?
KATIE TROTTER: 17:12
And Adam with that. That’s just another way that teams continue to build in that trust space, right? Hey, if we did have this miscommunication or we did have things not go the way that we thought they would, how great that we can just pick up the phone and have a conversation about it or set up a meeting and talk it through, so that that energy can be used towards again those end goals and the important work that organizations are trying to achieve.
ADAM SALGAT: 17:33
Yep, absolutely. I’d love to take the time to provide our listeners with some more ways to kind of help shift their perspective. Do you have any more questions that they could jot down? Hopefully you know, if they’re not driving, maybe listening at their desktop that they could jot down and ponder.
KATIE TROTTER: 17:50
Of course, these are great questions to ask yourself when you’re in a tough situation and want to grow from it. For example, one question might be what was I pretending not to know in this situation?
ADAM SALGAT: 18:03
Man, right away, you’re calling us out, right? But it’s true, sometimes we ignore red flags or avoid the truth because it’s easier in the moment to just ignore them, right? So we just ignore the idea that maybe we see something and we’re like, oh no, I don’t want to believe that right now.
KATIE TROTTER: 18:18
Yeah, either some concept that we want to avoid or some reality that we would prefer wasn’t there, and sometimes just nuances of the person we’re interacting with. Right, we know that somebody prefers to be communicated with a certain way, or needed things delivered in a different way to set them up for success. All right, the second one is how could I have approached?
ADAM SALGAT: 18:38
this differently. Sounds like another great one for after action reflection, right. So it’s not about beating yourself up, but it’s about learning. So you’re looking at it in through that lens of okay, I could approach this differently the next time and not wish you could go back and change things.
KATIE TROTTER: 18:55
Right. And then there’s also a question that I like to ask sometimes, which is what assumptions did I make that may not have been true.
ADAM SALGAT: 19:03
That can be a big one too. We all carry assumptions into conversations and into decisions, and they can really shape how things play out right.
KATIE TROTTER: 19:12
And Adam a great one could be. What can I learn from this? Regardless of who was right and I like this one a lot because it shifts the focus from winning to learning- that reminds me of a lot of the stereotypical conversations that is depicted on television and TV between husband and wife. Right, yes, yes. The goal is to win. The goal is to see who is correct as opposed to hey. How do we move forward from this?
ADAM SALGAT: 19:41
Yeah, absolutely. And what’s one of the last ones?
KATIE TROTTER: 19:44
How do I want to show up next time? And this one’s great, because you’ve taken that gap time to really focus on what is my intention. And then you’re thinking into the future. How do I want to move forward? How do I want to show up?
ADAM SALGAT: 19:57
well, Thank you for sharing those, and I can see how asking even one of them could completely change how someone processes a tough moment. Before we wrap up, I want to touch on something really important. You’ve told me before that ownership and these skills in general isn’t about perfection. Why is that reminder so critical?
KATIE TROTTER: 20:23
Because we are all going to mess up. We are all human and ownership isn’t about always getting it right. Like you said, the skills in general are not about always getting it right. It’s about being willing to reflect, to learn and then to get back up and try again, and that’s what builds resilience and respect.
ADAM SALGAT: 20:42
Yeah, I think so, and I think it builds trust right.
KATIE TROTTER: 20:44
Absolutely yeah.
ADAM SALGAT: 20:47
So there you have it. A healthy ownership mindset isn’t about blame, it’s about growth. It’s about choosing how you show up even when things go wrong. It’s about growth. It’s about choosing how you show up even when things go wrong. Katie, let’s hone it down to one level up opportunity for our listeners to focus on after listening to this audio cast.
KATIE TROTTER: 21:05
I’d encourage people to think about a recent situation that didn’t go the way that they wanted and, instead of asking whose fault was it, have them try asking what can I own here? Just see what opens up when you start to make that shift from blame to ownership.
ADAM SALGAT: 21:20
The ownership mindset is something that is talked about in our Our Community Serves class. Can you tell us more about that? And, as an alumni, if there’s alumni out there who have taken Our Community, listens, this is the next class to take, is that right?
KATIE TROTTER: 21:34
Yeah, our Community Serves is a two-day class that talks about behaviors and mindsets that help us to shift from a me-centric culture to a we-centric culture, and ownership is just one of five mindsets that we explore that really improve and increase accountability.
ADAM SALGAT: 21:52
Got it. If you’re interested in taking an Our Community Serves class, we have classes available throughout all of our regional learning hubs and you can find those on chapmancommunitiesorg. Katie, thank you again for your insights and your encouragement.
KATIE TROTTER: 22:06
Thanks for having me, adam. I always enjoy getting to have these conversations with you and I look forward to next time.
ADAM SALGAT: 22:12
And to our listeners. If this episode has resonated with you, I encourage you to share it with a colleague or a friend, and don’t forget to subscribe Until next time. I’m inviting you to walk your path with intention, because you are the message. Take care of my friends.
